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Author Topic: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design  (Read 39720 times)

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #60 on: April 03, 2012, 10:49:07 AM »
^ available sa element14 or you can request samples from TI, since they now own national semiconductors....
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #60 on: April 03, 2012, 10:49:07 AM »

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #61 on: April 03, 2012, 10:59:03 AM »
i borrowed the leach amp output stage....based on this circuit our output stage now becomes:

Q18, 16 x 2SC5200,
Q19, 16 x 2SA1943,
Q16, 1 x 2SC5200,
Q17, 1 x 2SA1943,
Q14, 1 x 2SC4793,
Q15, 1 x 2SA1837,
R45/R46, 32 ea. 0.15ohm/5watt resistor
R36, 27 ohm, 2 watt, metal film
R41,R42, 32 ea. 4.7ohm, 1 watt metal fim resistor
R34/R35, 220ohm, 1 watt metal film, shunted by a 1ufd/250v polypropylrne film cap




here is the rest of the article where prof. leach explains his preference for triple darlington over other output topologies...http://users.ece.gatech.edu/~mleach/lowtim/output.html
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Philippine Electronics Forum

Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #61 on: April 03, 2012, 10:59:03 AM »

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #62 on: April 03, 2012, 11:04:56 AM »
i borrowed the leach amp output stage....based on this circuit our output stage now becomes:

Q18, 16 x 2SC5200,
Q19, 16 x 2SA1943,
Q16, 1 x 2SC5200,
Q17, 1 x 2SA1943,
Q14, 1 x 2SC4793,
Q15, 1 x 2SA1837,
R45/R46, 32 ea. 0.15ohm/5watt resistor
R36, 27 ohm, 2 watt, metal film
R41,R42, 32 ea. 4.7ohm, 1 watt metal fim resistor
R34/R35, 220ohm, 1 watt metal film, shunted by a 1ufd/250v polypropylrne film cap




here is the rest of the article where prof. leach explains his preference for triple darlington over other output topologies...http://users.ece.gatech.edu/~mleach/lowtim/output.html

simple lang pala 3 darlington stage ng leach sir tony!

R34/R35, 220ohm, 1 watt metal film, shunted by a 1ufd/250v polypropylrne film cap

so between sya ng emitter of pre driver?

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #62 on: April 03, 2012, 11:04:56 AM »

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #63 on: April 03, 2012, 11:07:08 AM »
^yes, or it can just be a single 470ohm resistor since we will not be using feedforward compensation....
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Philippine Electronics Forum

Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #63 on: April 03, 2012, 11:07:08 AM »

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #64 on: April 03, 2012, 11:19:46 AM »
now let us tackle the biasing for our output stage.....

this is a Vbe multiplier circuit that we are using, it connects to the bases of Q14/Q15....since there are 6 diode drops involved, bias voltage can be over 2.4 volts....



R1 can be in series with 4 diodes string and mounted to the heatsink, so that as temperature increases, voltage across those diodes decreases, and so output stage bias decreases, preventing thermal runaways...R2 can also be in series with a 5K trimpot so that adjustment of output stage bias can be done....



C12 here can be 0.1 ufd, although you can use up to 1ufd/10 volt film cap, this cap is useful keeping the impedance of the Vbe multiplier very low at high frequencies.....

here are links for further reading:

CHAPTER 1 Analysis and Design of Biasing Circuits
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/107427-thermal-compensation-vbe-multiplier.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/101745-bob-cordell-interview-bjt-vs-mosfet-46.html#post1277243
http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/showthread.php?t=34254

next post we will tackle the output stage idle current bias....
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Philippine Electronics Forum

Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #64 on: April 03, 2012, 11:19:46 AM »

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #65 on: April 04, 2012, 08:04:58 AM »
further reading: these are output devices, http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/147656-bipolar-bjt-transistor-families-audio-power-output-stages-2.html
Quote
there are many technologies by manufacture to reach perfect data so as high linearity and transit frequency. The newest is "BiT-LA" (ST) and older versions are "M.E.T" (TOS), "LAPT" (Sanken), RET (FUJ) and EBT (NEC). I think, there are many more versions without especially abbrevation. Until this day I don't find a describtion about the advantages and the disadvantages between all this technologies. Perhaps one of you knows books or websites especially about this topic.
For me it is amazing, that the currently types of old motorola MJ series (e.g. MJ21193/MJ21194 without DC-SOA in data sheet) provides perfect sonic transmission by only 4 MHz ft. What is in real life the advantage for 10 times higher values of ft for audio power applications (possibly depending on whether the emitter follower or common emitter is used)?
In additional very helpful for me are to know the exactly titles of orig.data books and application notes from NEC and Fujitsu. Then I can order copies of this books by my tele rent library. Because the titles of all my own data books are very unspecifically (eg "power Devices" "discrete Power" "Bipolare Power" or "High Current Transistor"), I need the exact title of data book for order copies. Perhaps one of you knows orig. data books from NEC and Fujitsu between 1977 and 1987 about transistors for audio.
Thank you very much for your replies - I hope, you can understand my not perfect english

At follow a little overview from me about currently available so as no longer available BjT's for audio power amplifiers:

1) ST-Microelectronics "BiT-LA"
(bipolare junction transistor linear application - planar technology with an advanced base island layout)
http://www.st.com/stonline/products/...fo/2stcxxx.htm (ST)
2ST5949/2ST2121 250V 17A 250W hfe: 35-160 25MHz TO-3/TO-204
2STC5200/2STA1943 230V 15A 150W hfe: 35-160 30MHz TO-264
2STC5949/2STA2121 250V 17A 220W hfe: 35-160 25MHz TO-264
2STC5948/2STA2120 250V 17A 200W hfe: 35-160 25MHz TO-3P
2STC4467/2STA1694 120V 8A 80W hfe: 70-140 20MHz TO-3P
2STC4468/2STA1695 140V 10A 100W hfe: 50-140 20MHz TO-3P
2STC2510/2STA2510 100V 25A 125W hfe: 40- 80 20MHz TO-3P
2STC5242/2STA1962 230V 15A 130W hfe: 35-160 30MHz TO-3P
2STW4466/2STW1693 80V 6A 60W hfe: 50-120 20MHz TO-247
2STW4468/2STW1695 140V 10A 100W hfe: 50-120 20MHz TO-247

2) TOKYO SHIBAURA ELECTRIC CO (Toshiba) "M.E.T"
Multi Emitter Transistor
http://www.semicon.toshiba.co.jp/eng...tor/index.html
TO-3P(L) = TO-3P Large =TO264 TO-3P(N) = TO-3P (N=Normal)
2SA1939/2SC5196 80V 6A 60W hfe: 55-160 30MHzTO-3P(N)--
2SA1940/2SC5197 120V 8A 80W hfe: 55-160 30MHzTO-3P(N)--
2SA1941/2SC5198 140V 10A 100W hfe: 55-160 30MHz TO-3P(N)--
2SA1942/2SC5199 160V 12A 120W hfe: 55-160 30MHz TO-3P(L)--
2SA1943/2SC5200 230V 15A 150W hfe: 55-160 30MHz TO-3P(L)..
2SA1962/ 2SC5242 230V 15A 130W hfe: 55-160 30MHz TO-3P(N)..
2SA1986/2SC5358 230V 15A 150W hfe: 55-160 30MHz TO-3P(N)--
2SA1987/2SC5359 230V 15A 180W hfe: 55-160 30MHz TO-3P(L)--
2SA2120/2SC5948 200V 12A 200W hfe: 55-160 25MHz TO-3P(N)--
2SA2121/2SC5949 200V 15A 220W hfe: 55-160 25MHzTO-3P(L)--
2SA1302/2SC3281 old type, see MJW1302A/MJW3281A from onsemi
2SA1095/2SC2565 160V 15A 150W hfe: 40min 60MHz RM60 (34,3x16,3x5,3mm), old type, gr/bl
http://www.datasheetcatalog.net/de/d.../2SA1095.shtml
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/42...scription.html
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/43...scription.html
http://www.pat2pdf.org/ (4297597) and (4339765)

3) Fairchild - Toshiba
(also "M.E.T" = Multi Emitter Transistor ?)
www.fairchildsemi.com/ds/2S/2SC5200.pdf
http://www.fairchildsemi.com/pf/FJ/FJL4315.html
http://www.fairchildsemi.com/sitesea...ttr2=Power+BJT
FJL4215/FJL4315: see Toshiba 2SA1943/2SC5200
FJA4213//FJA4313 see Toshiba 2SA1962/ 2SC5242

4) a. ON (Single Emitter ? - I don't know)
http://www.onsemi.com/PowerSolutions...rics.do?id=796
MJ21195/MJ21196 250V 16A 250W hfe: 25-75 5MHz TO-3/TO-204
MJ21193/MJ21194 250V 16A 250W hfe: 25-75 5MHz TO-3/TO-204
MJL21195G/MJL21196G 250V 16A 200W hfe: 25-75 4MHz TO-3PBL (TO-264)
MJL21193G/MJL21194G 250V 16A 200W hfe: 25-75 4MHz TO-3PBL (TO-264)
MJW21195G/MJW21196G 250V 16A 200W hfe: 20-80 4MHz TO-247
MJW21193G/MJW21194G 250V 16A 200W hfe: 20-70 4MHz TO-247
NJW21193G/NJW21194G 250V 16A 200W hfe: 20-70 4MHz TO-3P
MJW21191G/MJW21192G 150V 8A 100W hfe: 15-100 4MHz TO-247
4) b. ON -Toshiba "M.E.T" = Multi Emitter Transistor
MJL1302A/MJL3281A 250V 16A 200W hfe: 75-150 30MHz TO-3PBL (TO-264)
MJL4302A/MJL4281A 350V 15A 230W hfe: 80-250 35MHz TO-3PBL (TO-264)
MJW1302A/MJW3281A 230V 15A 200W hfe: 50-200 30MHz TO-247
NJW1302A/NJW3281A 250V 15A 200W hfe: 75-150 30MHz TO-3P
NJW0302G/0281G 250V 15A 150W hfe: 75-150 30MHz TO-3P

5) Sanken "LAPT" (Large Area Parallel Transistor)
http://www.sanken-ele.co.jp/en/prod/..._u/ptr_01e.htm
2SA1380/2SC4886 150V 14A 80W hfe: 50min 50MHz TO-3PF (FM100)
2SA1186/2SC2837 150V 10A 100W hfe: 50min 60MHz TO-3P (MT100)
2SA1303/2SC3284 150V 14A 125W hfe: 50min 50MHz TO-3P (MT100)
2SA1386/2SC3519 160V 15A 130W hfe: 50min 40MHz TO-3P (MT100)
2SA1294/2SC3263 230V 15A 130W hfe: 50min 35MHz TO-3P (MT100)
2SA1215/2SC2921 160V 15A 150W hfe: 50min 50MHz MT200
2SA1216/2SC2922 180V 17A 200W hfe: 30min 40MHz MT200
2SA1295/2SC3264 230V 17A 200W hfe: 50min 35MHz MT200
2SA1494/2SC3858 200V 17A 200W hfe: 50min 20MHz MT200


6) Fujitsu "R.E.T." (Ringemitter Transistor) all types old
http://www.datasheetcatalog.net/de/d.../2SA1078.shtml (driver stage ft 140 MHz TO220)
2SA1003/2SC2323, TO-3 (no original Datasheet)
http://www.datasheetarchive.com/2SA1044-datasheet.html
2SA1043/2SC2433 120V 10A 150W hfe: 35-200 60MHz TO-3, old type
2SA1044/2SC2434 70V 10A 150W hfe: 35-200 60MHz TO-3, old type
http://www.classiccmp.org/rtellason/...ta/2sa1075.pdf
2SA1075/2SC2525 gr/bl 120V 12A 120W hfe: 60-200 60MHz RM60 (34,3x16,3x5,3mm), old type
2SA1076/2SC2526 gr/bl 120V 12A 120W hfe: 60-200 60MHz RM60 (34,3x16,3x5,3mm), old type
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/57...scription.html
http://www.pat2pdf.org/ 5786622

7) NEC E.B.T Transistor (Emitter Ballast Transistor) all types old
2SA1141/2SC2681 blue/bl 115V 10A 100W hfe: 60-200 80MHz similar TO247 (no orig. NEC datasheet)
http://www.alldatasheet.com/datashee...C/2SA1141.html (datasheet ETC clone)
http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~ii_on/re...g/DSC02881.JPG (Foto)
2SA1227/2SC2987 gr/bl 140V 12A 120W hfe: 60-320 50MHz similar TO247
2SA1227A/2SC2987A gr/bl 140V 12A 120W hfe: 60-320 50MHz similar TO247
http://www.datasheetcatalog.net/de/d.../2SA1227.shtml (only short form data)
http://www.niji.or.jp/home/k-nisi/a-10.html (used in integrated amp NEC A10)
http://homepage2.nifty.com/~mhitaste...pparts010.html (supplier)
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6403436.html
http://www.pat2pdf.org/ 6403436

8) Matsushita/Panasonic MESA (RET, MET or EBT?) all types old
(outfit like Mesa table hill skyline Arizona)
2SA1064/2SC2488 150V 8A 100W hfe: 40-280 50MHz TO-3
2SA1065/2SC2489 150V 10A 120W hfe: 40-200 50MHz TO-3
http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/data.../2SA1065.shtml
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #66 on: April 04, 2012, 09:48:49 PM »
output stage idle current bias......

with 16 power transistors at our output stage, how are we going to bias those many trannies?

let us say we bias each of our output trannies at say 50mA each, at rail voltage of 50volts, our total idle current amounts to 800mA, total dissipation of our output stage then is 80watts.......

at this power level, our amp will output about 20 watts of pure classA, above this power level operation switches to ClassAB till the rated power of 500watts into 1 ohm,


further readings......

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/137115-can-class-ab-pp-amp-said-operating-class-low-signal-levels.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/162482-collection-class-b-topologies-100ma-idle-sound-closest-class.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/198361-dan-dagostino-momentum-sonic-character-like-pure-classa-se-despite-low-idle-power.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/191907-class-ab-being-mismaligned-3.html
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #67 on: April 08, 2012, 07:53:27 PM »

Happy Easter to all Elabers.....

Greg Erskine compiled these tables so that we can use this as lookup table........

Small Signal Transistors:
http://users.tpg.com.au/gerskine/greg/PNP%20Small%20Signal%20Transistors.htm

VAS transistors:
http://users.tpg.com.au/gerskine/greg/vas%20transistors.htm

Driver Transistors:
http://users.tpg.com.au/gerskine/greg/Driver%20Transistors.htm

Output Transistors
http://users.tpg.com.au/gerskine/greg/Output%20Transistors.htm


* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #68 on: April 09, 2012, 08:27:42 PM »
happy belated easter din :)

nice sir tony, more pa!

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #69 on: April 11, 2012, 03:49:40 PM »
realizing that the amp would be built in two banks for the left and right channels, LM4702 is not suitable, better to use the LME49810,  http://www.national.com/pf/LM/LME49810.html#Overview

datasheet: http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lme49810.pdf

this front-end driver chips has even better qualities, for one the 60mA source or sink current....remember that we need 6.4mA peak input current to swing 64A output current, so in this case triple darlington is not required, just a darlington output stage is sufficient.......

Key Specification
■  Wide operating voltage range   20V to 100V
■  Slew Rate   50V/μs (typ)
■  Output Drive Current   60mA (typ)
■  PSRR (f = DC)   110dB (typ)
■  THD+N (f = 1kHz)   0.0007 (typ)

for this design, the driver chip will be fed from a regulated +/-50 volts supply capable of at least 250mA output current....

the darlington output stage will then be fed off an unregulated supply of +/-50 volts unloaded.....the rails can sag to +/-35 and we can still hit out target of 500 watts into 1 ohm speaker load.....

* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #70 on: April 11, 2012, 04:13:34 PM »
yeah! :)
nice info sir tony!
yan ang una kung trip bago yung lm4702


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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #71 on: April 11, 2012, 08:35:36 PM »
sit tony posible po ba yung triple stage quasi?

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #72 on: April 11, 2012, 09:25:37 PM »
ganito ba tinutukoy mo sis?


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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #73 on: April 11, 2012, 09:49:02 PM »
;D ;D yan na nga

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #74 on: April 12, 2012, 07:49:43 AM »
sit tony posible po ba yung triple stage quasi?


pwede yan......
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #75 on: April 12, 2012, 10:46:24 AM »
output stage idle current bias......

with 16 power transistors at our output stage, how are we going to bias those many trannies?

let us say we bias each of our output trannies at say 50mA each, at rail voltage of 50volts, our total idle current amounts to 800mA, total dissipation of our output stage then is 80watts.......

at this power level, our amp will output about 20 watts of pure classA, above this power level operation switches to ClassAB till the rated power of 500watts into 1 ohm,


further readings......

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/137115-can-class-ab-pp-amp-said-operating-class-low-signal-levels.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/162482-collection-class-b-topologies-100ma-idle-sound-closest-class.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/198361-dan-dagostino-momentum-sonic-character-like-pure-classa-se-despite-low-idle-power.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/191907-class-ab-being-mismaligned-3.html

sir tony 16 OPT for 500w? dami naman nun for 1 channel?
you need more OPT for higher SOA since this amp can drive 1ohm impedance tama ba?

Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #76 on: April 12, 2012, 11:58:40 AM »
Quote
sir tony 16 OPT for 500w? dami naman nun for 1 channel?
you need more OPT for higher SOA since this amp can drive 1ohm impedance tama ba?



actually sa positive rail pa lang yan, ang total ay 32 power trannies.....read back some more and this will become clearer...

for a darlington output stage, total is 34 trannies......2SC5200/2SA1943....

more output trannies means larger SOA, but the other consideration is beta droop, i chose to use the power trannie up to a point on its hFE curves where current gain remains high....this is what i wanted to emphasize....
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #77 on: April 12, 2012, 01:44:52 PM »
wow sa positive rail palang yun hehe! :)

ulitin ko pag backread ko!

16pcs OPT for + rail (2SC5200)
16pcs OPT for - rail (2SA1943)

total= 32pcs OPT or 16pairs complimentary

additional 2pcs or 1 pair  (2SC5200/2SA1943) for diver

total= 34pcs (2SC5200/2SA1943) use for driver and OPT

ayun may nahanap ako beta droop explaination  ;)
http://books.google.com.ph/books?id=kRHaAsutYV0C&pg=PA369&lpg=PA369&dq=beta+droop&source=bl&ots=PAlf9I-y-D&sig=SKT4NZisgYwHciEOUt8JJ3G75Rk&hl=en&sa=X&ei=TGyGT8G1EY2imQWC5ui6Bw&ved=0CCoQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=beta%20droop&f=false

Offline mund24

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #78 on: April 12, 2012, 02:06:16 PM »
OK din pala 2sc3281/2sa1302 or MJL3281/MJL1302

yun mga lang medyo pricey VS 2sa5200/2sc1943

beta droop from the first link that i post


Offline tony

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Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #79 on: April 12, 2012, 02:46:57 PM »
Quote
OK din pala 2sc3281/2sa1302 or MJL3281/MJL1302


Motorola before they became ON semi got a license from Toshiba to manufacture those MJL3281/MJL1302 trannies....

the Toshiba 2sc3281/2sa1302 were forerunners of the 2SC5200 before they became obsolete.....looks like other semicon houses picked up where toshiba left off...

so now we know that the thing to look at in a power trannie are its transistion frequency, fT, and beta, hFE.......then the SOA is looked at next....

notice that mere Ic max and Pdmax specs does not give a complete picture of the capacity of any power output trannie....
* you simulate a circuit because you know how it works and wants to tweak,
not because you want to learn how that circuit works....
simulations do not teach you to be circuit smart...it comes with experience....
*audio power amps are also subject to the laws of thermodynamics, no escaping it....
*do not judge any amp by its schematics, drawing lang yon, look instead at the finished amp,
 it tells a lot about the amp and its builder.....
http://ronelex.com/bias-current-output-transistor-amplifier/156

Philippine Electronics Forum

Re: 500 watts into 1ohm SS amplifier design
« Reply #79 on: April 12, 2012, 02:46:57 PM »

 

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